SpawnPoint - Where Game Begins

Hmmm, looks like I got a little carried away in that last reply, sorry about that. One I should have slept on.

I don't entirely disagree with you and in an ideal world I would agree with you entirely, but that isn't where we live. If it's legal it isn't necessarily right and if it's illegal it isn't necessarily wrong, in the vast majority of cases it is, just not always.

Take the recent scandal in the UK over our elected members of parliament milking the expenses system for as much as they could get. For the most part what they were doing was legal, there were a couple that crossed the line into fraud, but most of the abuses were legal. MPs expenses were not a matter of public record so we had no idea what was going on, until someone who worked processing these claims got so sick of the crazy stuff they were claiming for he copied all the information and sent it to a newspaper.

What he did was illegal, he'd signed the official secrets acts and clearly broke it by sending that information to a newspaper and what most of the MPs were doing was entirely legal. As far as I am aware the person who leaked the info has not been prosecuted and you would struggle to find anyone in this country, other than a small number of now former MPs, who thinks that he should be prosecuted. In fact most people would want to give him a medal. What he did was illegal but right, what they did (the fraudulent ones excluded) was legal but wrong.

What Anonymous do is not so clear cut. With the HBGary thing what they did was clearly illegal, what they found was far more sinister. You have US companies with government ties planning to illegally take down "troublesome" websites using cyber attacks and underhand tactics like misinformation and smear campaigns against those involved or supporting the websites. With the Visa and Paypal thing they brought a news story to prominence, one that I as a customer of Visa and Paypal was unaware of. Both of those things are in the public interest to know about.

I don't always support what Anonymous do, I don't think they should be let off with breaking the law and I certainly don't support any continued harassment of HBGary staff by Anonymous or from Anonymous wanabes. I don't even expect to support (in a completely passive and none financial way) them for much longer, pretty soon I'm sure they'll pick the wrong target, cause a serious problem or get carried away with the media coverage.

Two wrongs don't make a right but a small wrong that exposes a rather large wrong can be in the publics best interests.

I read a top tip awhile ago that would sort out all this Anonymous and Wikileaks thing:


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Oooh, a hot topic, I love it.

CP, thanks for correcting my points; it's not that I was wrong, it's just my reasons were wrong.

X, your argument isn't falling on deaf ears. I understand completely that it's a serious detriment to business when a service that is required to be up to make money is, well, it's down. Companies like Mastercard and Visa lost, potentially, millions of dollars when their international websites went down as a result of the DDoS, and that's a significant number, but when has it been the right for an American company to remove the right for someone outside the boundaries of the United States to speak freely and to accept donations from supporters internationally? When has it been their right to violate not only the American constitution, which is beginning to look more like "The Pirate Code" than anything, but international law that states that you have the right to speak your mind.

We needed a whistleblower like Julian Assange, otherwise, our international governments would be able to, at their discretion, and only theirs, conduct business how they see fit; ignoring ethics and morals and even laws. The public, within reason, has the right to know about the functioning of the government. Obama, in his campaign, pledged a transparent government; which he's been pretty good about, but the cables that Wikileaks released showed that there was still room for improvement.

Let's leave the whole issue of Cyber-Terrorism vs. What is actually happening behind for now, it's not the issue and it really doesn't need to be addressed. CP is right, X, people opposing what you are doing and taking action against it is part of running a business. You cannot support everyone at the same time unless your business involves handing out free money to everyone. As such, you will always have a group of people who want change, and a louder group who doesn't, and the business will usually listen to the group with the most money.

If we're being honest, X, both sides of the political spectrum are screaming at each other and pointing fingers and nothing is getting accomplished. To say that it is the Conservative spin machine that is perpetuating, or perhaps hiding, the issues that Anonymous is exposing is just downright wrong. Fox news, the GOP, and even the Democrats are equally responsible for the constant stream of BS and incorrect statements that puts a harsh light on simple situations. This whole Wikileaks issue is a prime example.

Planned Parenthood and similar organizations are already considered rather controversial. Abortion, well, that's a topic I'm not going to touch. In short, it shouldn't be up to a group of men to decide wether a woman wants to carry through with her pregnancy or not, it should be the choice of the woman. But moving on.


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I would debate that. America has progressed from a healthy democracy to a disaster waiting to happen. Look at Scott Walker, look at the rallies all across the country. I love Obama, and I think he's doing a great job considering what the situation was when he entered office, but the country is falling into the hands of idiots who think they can get away with anything. Poitic is supposed to, in a proper democratic system, cater to the people, not the beliefs of a few who govern said people.

America is starting to look like Apple Inc. One person, or one group of people is telling you what you can and can't do with your device (your freedom, I guess, in this case).