Clinton and Obama leaves me encouraged

[XTR3M3]

It really is encouraging to me to see that a couple of non-white males have made it this far into the election process. It is about time we, as a nation, get over the complete ignorance that is racism and sexism. To long has talent gone untapped because of the color of someone's skin or whether or not they have bewbs.

Do not mistake this for an endorsement of either candidate as I disagree with them politically. There doesn't seem to be a candidate that I can be behind 100% at this point. I might have to do the "lesser of 2 evils" choice that I have done in the past. I always vote for the one that helps me and my family the most. I do prefer fiscal conservatism as well....I am not seeing much of that lately either...

I really look forward to the time where people will be viewed completely on their skills and abilities. Why should we have to refer to Obama as the "black candidate" or to Clinton as a "female candidate"? Not everyone does but too many still do. I do realize these 2 are trend setters. I would love to see these distinctions put to rest and hear only about how good they will be for the country.

When that can happen, it will be a great day.

[Insomnia]

I agree with you and i believe the idea is already set in motion.

They already made it this far and that should stand for something... As for the ignorance of humanity that will take a while to wash away as it is impossible for it to be an overnight thing.

But again i totally agree with you except what i see wrong with them is they are fighting each other so bad to the point that when they do get a nomination they will be too tired politically to be able to fight a McCain who is probably working on the next stage as we speak while Clinton and Obama still linger around who will beat the other.

[AwptimusPrime]

Yeah I agree. I was listening to the news and political analysts say that McCain may end up winning with all the bitterness between Obama and Clinton over race and gender.

[Insomnia]

Not only race and gender, what supposedly started as a clean sweep for Hillary Clinton has turned into negative campaigning between Obama and Clinton. And unfortunately that could very well be the only way she can hurt his campaign. Not to mention that even if she does win, who would want to be her Vice President with Bill Clinton in the house as the first gentlemen...

[IrOnHeAdShOt]

It really doesnt matter what color your skin is or what gender you are in politics. The important thing is to be a good Politician and all those other stuffs. Like being Loyal to people

[Insomnia]

That is how it should be ironheashot, but it is not how it is... Many fear a JFK type thing on obama if he wins.. which i do not doubt at all seeing as how dirty politics have been lately.

[canttouchthis]

I agree politcally more with obama and clinton than mccain, however I have to criticize them a tad. How much of their support is based soley on their race/sex? If obama was white, would he have that much support? If hillary were a man, would she have made it this far? I'm not saying either are underqualified, although there are those that suggest that, however I'm merely saying I think they get a lot of their support from race/sex. You should really just ignore it, not endorse it.

[Titan]

Have you checked out the poll numbers? Have your checked out the demographics for each primary and caucus that has passed already?

Obama has a huge white following, and female following. He isn't winning because he is black. He is winning because a lot of people believe in his ideals, his stance on campaign issues, and what he brings to the table.

With the Presedential vote impending, and the Democratic party soon to name a nominee, I'm hoping we see a lot of different viewpoints here at Spawnpoint, based on the data already compiled, and actual facts.

Geraldine Ferraro was pressured into leaving her campaign post for Clinton, because of similar remarks made, on how supposedly Obama has so much support simply because he is black. It's pure and utter nonsense.

[canttouchthis]

Titan... Just because he has a large white following doesn't mean he doesn't get votes because of his race. They could vote simply out of guilt caused by the same mentality that caused the affirmative action effect. Now don't get me wrong, I do agree with them on a ton of their points, and they have potential. For me, it just won't be the same without mike gravel for pres...
Oh and politcally, Obama and clinton are practically Identical. The only major difference that I see is that obama was never for the war, and clinton once was.
This isn't to say that there are those that support them for their policy,
But a lot of no issue voters vote for reasons like that.

[Titan]

Clinton is also a major flip flopper on the issues, depending on how the situation suits her.

She also has been involved with illegal contributions in the Whitewater land deal.

She also has had severe memory lapses in which events that she claims transpired, never did.

Also the 209k in unpaid Healthcare costs for her campaign staff. Sure, she cannot pay costs for her own staff, but she is going to provide Healthcare for a nation.

Too many question with her, when it comes to my own liking at least.

79% percent of votes tallied are by white voters, and yet Obama still has a decent lead...

Seems obvious to me.

[canttouchthis]

I'm not arguing for or against either. Some say there are trust issues with obama because of his preacher, and not to mention his alleged ties to the black panthers. At any rate, people think the president has more power than he/she does typically. The real power is in the S.C, and Congress.

[Atrus]

The more I see and hear the more disappointed I become with these candidates. Just a few thoughts on each, ladies first.

CLINTON: The great Clinton political "Machine" - on the wings of destiny - crash and burn. She started off with high negatives, and the recent and terminal cases of foot in mouth disease by both her and Bill assures that her campaign is over. One point that hasn't gotten much if any discussion by the media is the "White Support" component. After years of dedicated service and support the Clinton campaign was thrown under the bus and left abandoned by the black community. Obama had better win the big chair for the sake of black people because they will likely have a very difficult time finding any major white politician to provide the kind of support the Clinton's gave. All of that aside Clinton has on so many levels run a terrible and grossly inadequate campaign - she does not qualify to be President.

OBAMA: An earlier post noted the JFK connection... not that there is anything to this, it's just anytime we have a leader that awakens the populous the crazy's seem to come out. This really is a must win for Obama because of the black vote. Normally, in any given race there is a proportional division between candidates where one will come away with an average of 5 to 25% of the popular vote. The fact Obama is pulling 9:1 or 90% of the black vote is not healthy for the democrat party. This kind of division spells trouble ahead, and yes to his credit Obama has done well with the college graduate middle class white voter. I must admit in listening to him speak I too have been moved by the quality of the message. Unfortunately, Obama too now seems to be suffering from the same illness as Bill and Hilary... off hand remarks about troubled middle class with the hand guns and their bibles. Yikes - he's on CNN as I type trying to explain the statement. Frankly, this along with much of what we see is all media hype and not productive to discussion of the important issues or problem solving.

McCAIN: At first I thought I could vote for this man. A war hero in a time of war seemed like the prudent choice. What I didn't know then but realize now is with McCain we're looking at at least four more years of the Bush doctrine. Lot's of strong rhetoric on the war, but little effort or attention given to what are very real and serious social and economic problems facing us here at home. Either way I have a feeling the polls that favor him over either Dem are reflective of the division in the Democrat party, and when that goes away the polls will shift. What the Democrats don't seem to understand is that with both a woman and the black man on the ticket the party has a shot at a 16 year run. Regardless, the Republican party is so confused and disoriented and the American people so disgusted with Bush there simply is no way the Republicans get the call for 2008. That is of course unless they come up with some dramatic way to play the fear card once again. All this truly is unfortunate, because I do sense that McCain could've been a good leader.

A cautionary note -- be mindful of the media, they too have an agenda and a bottom line. Let me touch on one example seen here is this thread. The post is correct in saying that a candidate did the "Flip-Flop" -- but let's stop for a moment and analyze what's being done. An educated leader, is given new information, becomes aware of changing circumstances, or simply feels they were initially incorrect. To change ones mind is a gift from God and has little to do with a recreational slipper. Let's keep in mind that our current fearless leader can't or won't change his mind and we have 4,000+ dead and a Trillion down the "aluminum" tubes. Too often we're programmed putting one side against the other, and make no mistake it's in the media's best interest to stir up as much meaningless rhetoric as possible to keep the news cycles humming.

When the dust settles and two candidates emerge I hope those of you who have interest will look beyond the rhetoric, and beyond any party affiliations because America seems to do alright when we vote our conscience. Now more than ever it's not about being a good Democrat or Republican -- it's about what's best for America -- VOTE.

~A

[freelancer]

Originally Posted by Titan

Clinton is also a major flip flopper on the issues, depending on how the situation suits her.

She also has been involved with illegal contributions in the Whitewater land deal.

She also has had severe memory lapses in which events that she claims transpired, never did.

Also the 209k in unpaid Healthcare costs for her campaign staff. Sure, she cannot pay costs for her own staff, but she is going to provide Healthcare for a nation.

Too many question with her, when it comes to my own liking at least.

79% percent of votes tallied are by white voters, and yet Obama still has a decent lead...

Seems obvious to me.

Yup she has also not made public her income tax return yet. Which all other candidates have. Also she seems to have 'misremembered' a lot lately. And NO Obama is not getting votes just because he is black. On a side note this will be the first time since JFK that a senator will be president. And to solve the economic problems people just need to learn to spend less than what they make. It is very simple if you make $10 only spend $9.

[Atrus]

I don't have a preference at this point either way, but let's at least keep our facts straight. Clinton did turn over her tax records. How else do we know that her and Willy brought in $109M in 2007.

"And NO Obama is not getting votes just because he is black." -- I'd like to hear then how for the first time in the history of Presidential elections a candidate has a better than 9:1 ratio of black, or any other race of voters. There's nothing wrong with voting your own race, perhaps even to be expected... just don't ignore the truth.

~A